Many Strength of Thousands moods are choppy or fail entirely

[leadmagnet]

I’ve been working my way through the Strength of Thousands soundsets as part of preparation to run that campaign, and I’ve been having some difficulty getting a clean playback of many of the moods, notably the busier ones associated with combat. The sound will stutter severely and in some cases cut out entirely.

Playing the soundset in firefox seems to help but is not ideal as it may cause issues with VTTs etc.

I’ve seen in some other posts that the dev team have been able to address the issue at the server side by fixing up the affected soundsets. Would it be possible to have a look at the affected sets and see if anything can be done? I’ve linked a particularly severe example (“Stone ghost combat”) below. This typically cuts out entirely within about 10-15 seconds of starting, except in firefox.

Syrinscape

Thanks

[benjamin]

Heya @leadmagnet.

Thanks for posting.

Here’s a thread with LOTS of info about this:

Is there a way to get better service quality? - achieving smooth playback in the Web Player

Heya @bjornsundell and @msplanton, Thanks for your questions and comments etc Always VERY welcome! I’ll give you a whole lot of info that should be useful to LOTS of peeps! Soooo… the Web Player is a VERY different beast to the Unity based Fantasy Player. It has allowed some AMAZING things (eg Players joining without an account or app install, automatic download of required Samples without preinstalls, better quality panning and reverb), BUT also the Web Play…

And, yes, I will take a look at that MOOD on our benchmarking machine… and you might continue to point out some more particularly problematic MOODs you find.

BUT do note the instant fix for the moment = just switch off a couple elements, especially any that look really busy + save a CUSTOM MOOD for yourself to use when you get to the game.

Hope all that helps?

[leadmagnet]

Hi @benjamin,

Thanks for your quick reply! I did encounter the thread you linked while researching the issue; I have checked that particular mood now on several browsers, ensuring that in each case it was running in an individual tab. The results were:

Vivaldi, Chrome, Edge, plus a dedicated VTT chromium client: Choppy playback / Issue present

Firefox, Librewolf: Smooth playback / Issue not present

The common element seems to be Chromium?

** Update: I also just tried the “Confronting the high priest” mood in Vivaldi, with the result being moderate choppiness, about in line with “ST-Bout 2” below

There are quite a lot of Moods in the Strength of Thousands Soundsets that exhibit the issue to one degree or another (and I’ve been focusing entirely on book 1 of 6 so far). I can work through them and try to make an comprehensive list but I feel that would probably be unhelpful at this stage?

Instead I selected a few more moods that exhibit the same behaviour, to varying degrees, hopefully these will help with debugging

“ST-Bout 1”
** Had to remove this link due to new user restrictions: Querystring is soundset=90415&element=1469295&mood=267022 **
This mood has some very mild stuttering for me when played in a Chromium browser

“ST-Bout 2”

Syrinscape

This mood has more pronounced stuttering, and long pauses, but generally seems to recover and continue eventually

“ST-Bout 3”

Syrinscape

This mood has more severe stuttering and tends to cut out entirely after a short while, similar to Stone ghost combat. I can see the visual waveform still moving, but with no audio.

I hope this is helpful.

[benjamin]

Hi,

All useful info. I’ll dive into those and see if I can fix them up.

In the meantime, TO MAKE SURE, you CAN now get these to play by just switching off a couple of things, right?

[leadmagnet]

Hi,

Sorry for the delay; I just tested with ST-Bout3, and removed the 10 or so effects further down the list (grouping starts with Exertion (high)), and the audio plays smoothly. I can then reintroduce about 5 or so of those and it continues to cope (just about!).

The limitations seem to be performance bound. My computer is of moderate spec, though the CPU is a bit old (Ryzen 5 2600, 16GB RAM, RTX 3070… does GPU play a part?). I’m concerned that some of my players on more basic setups and be more severely affected than me. I’m hoping to get a hold of a few of them when they’re available and test out a little.

Thanks again for looking into this!

[benjamin]

OK!

Sooo… actually it looks like this SoundSet had NOT yet had a benchmarking pass with me. Playing those three MOODs did indeed show performance issues on our weak-old-laptop. I have made (lite) versions of any problematic MOODs which you can now use.

So YOUR task now becomes, let us know any other MOODs you find which your device struggles with and I will check those too.

Re your players: hopefully if the sounds are running smoothly on YOUR machine (which is having to run the interface and playback animations etc,) then your players shouldn’t have a prob… so just run for your own ears and you should be right.

Let us know how you go… and mainly have a FUN game!

THANK YOU for using our sounds… we worked HARD on them.

[leadmagnet]

OK, there’s quite a few to get through for this whole campaign, so let’s break this down into individual books to make it a little easier to digest.

WARNING TO ANYONE READING THIS We’ll likely be referencing book and track titles which may constitute spoilers for the Strength of Thousands Pathfinder adventure path. Continue at your own risk!

I started by trying the Lite versions of ST-Bout 1-3 and I’m happy to say they work perfectly. Thank you for those!

In fact overall, things today seem to be performing a little better than they have in the past; I’m not sure if you did some kind of optimisation on the soundset overall or if my computer is just having a good day today

To help categorise these, I assigned them a scoring system based on my intial experience with ST-Bout 1-3 which conveniently spanned the full range from minor stuttering to complete breakdown.

1: Minor stuttering; occasional interruptions of half a second or less
2. Major stuttering; several second long interruptions or frequent short gaps
3. Complete breakdown; audio stops playing and doesn’t come back until I stop the mood.

Fortunately, only a few tracks in book 1 gave me any issues today:

Stone Ghost Combat: 2.5
element=1472022&soundset=90416&mood=266996

Gremlin Combat: 1
element=1472022&soundset=90416&mood=266993

Griffon Combat: 1
element=1472022&soundset=90416&mood=267011

Next chance I get I’ll take a swing at book 2 and let you know.

Thanks for all your hard work on these soundsets, I’m really looking forward to the extra immersion they’ll create for our game!

[benjamin]

@leadmagnet

Stone Ghost Combat

OK! These are fixed = (lite) version now available for all three of these MOODs (plus I simplified the actual full MOODs a bit too in a couple of places).

Keep these coming! It’s GREAT to have someone watching out for these!

[leadmagnet]

Alright, I’ve gone through the moods for book 2. This book has a lot more moods, a greater portion of which are combat themes, so there’s a large list below! A few of them already had lite variants, although even some of those produced minor stuttering for me.

Here we go (sorry!)

Terra-cotta guardian combat: 1
element=1509901&soundset=96137&search-panel=c&mood=278574

Wood Golem Combat: 1.5
element=1509901&soundset=96137&search-panel=c&mood=278578

Cobra and viper combat: 2.5
element=1509901&soundset=96137&search-panel=c&mood=278580

Tiger combat: 1
element=1509901&soundset=96137&search-panel=c&mood=278584

Basilisk Combat: 1
element=1627160&soundset=96137&search-panel=c&mood=278587

Mpeshi Combat: 1
element=1627160&soundset=96137&search-panel=c&mood=278588

BW-Mashkudu and Kiro combat: 1
element=1539952&soundset=96138&search-panel=c&mood=278601

BW-Lizardfolk combat: 0.5
element=1624163&soundset=96138&search-panel=c&mood=278602

GS-Poltergeist combat: 3 (This one appears to already have a lite variant (below), noting it for completeness)
element=1544365&soundset=96139&search-panel=c&mood=278608

GS-Poltergeist combat (lite): 1
element=1544365&soundset=96139&search-panel=c&mood=512602

GS-Guard Combat: 3
element=1544365&soundset=96139&search-panel=c&mood=278612

OT-Carnivorous plants combat: 3
element=1544365&soundset=96139&search-panel=c&mood=278615

OT-Ochre jelly combat: 1
element=1544365&soundset=96139&search-panel=c&mood=278616

OT-Oozes combat: 1
element=1544365&soundset=96139&search-panel=c&mood=278617

FD-Minotaur combat: 1
element=1552747&soundset=96140&search-panel=c&mood=278622

FD-Striding fires combat: 1.5 (This one also already has a lite variant)
element=1552747&soundset=96140&search-panel=c&mood=278624

FD-Hellcat combat: 1
element=1571065&soundset=96140&search-panel=c&mood=278625

FD-Ubano combat: 1
element=1576212&soundset=96140&search-panel=c&mood=278626

FF-Grippli combat: 3
element=1513307&soundset=96141&search-panel=c&mood=278634

FF-Old thrasher combat: 3
element=1513307&soundset=96141&search-panel=c&mood=278635

FF-I’iko dragons and dragonfly combat: 3 (Another one with a lite variant already)
element=1513307&soundset=96141&search-panel=c&mood=278637

FF-I’iko dragons and dragonfly combat (lite): 1
element=1605901&soundset=96141&search-panel=c&mood=512601

FF-Froglegs and Grubush combat: 3
element=1605901&soundset=96141&search-panel=c&mood=278638

CT-Nairo and Kreekoss combat: 1 (Already has lite variant)
element=1605901&soundset=96141&search-panel=c&mood=278640

Serpentfolk combat: 1.5
element=1582354&soundset=96142&search-panel=c&mood=278560

Water cobra combat: 2
element=1624005&soundset=96142&search-panel=c&mood=278563

Grodair combat: 1.5
element=1624005&soundset=96142&search-panel=c&mood=278564

Gbahali combat: 3
element=1624005&soundset=96142&search-panel=c&mood=278565

Coil and dweomercat combat: 1
element=1624005&soundset=96142&search-panel=c&mood=278566

Venom caller combat: 1.5
element=1624005&soundset=96142&search-panel=c&mood=278567

Salathiss combat: 1
element=1624005&soundset=96142&search-panel=c&mood=278569

Salathiss combat (more music): 0.5 (This variant emphasises the music and turns off some of the elements compared to the last one; it still stuttered just a tiny bit for me)
element=1624005&soundset=96142&search-panel=c&mood=298668

Four more books to go

[benjamin]

@leadmagnet

Here we go (sorry!)

Heya! No apologies accepted! Actually = THANK YOU!

This is GREAT to have another set of ears with another device going over these!

I’ve gone through and fixed up all of these.

The general procedure is:

1. Find a few unnecessary reverb settings (eg three elements set to [city] [forest] and [plain] should all be set to [forest], since these three reverbs all sounds VERY close…)

2. Turning off a few VERY soft background hisses and occasional frogs etc = where they are not really adding anything anyway… AND often turing ONE of the TWO armor foley elements off.

Have fun playing with these! How’s the game going?!

AND PLEASE, don’t hesitate to let me know when you find MORE glitchy things!

[leadmagnet]

In fact we haven’t started yet! Our current campaign is still ongoing, although I believe we’re in the final chapter, we’ve missed several weeks due to people’s availability. So it goes, particularly around this time of year.

I also was able to put together a setup allowing me to relay audio to a discord bot from a (non chromium) browser on my machine, following a helpful guide on this forum by Amerisun; this will allow me to greatly mitigate the issues we’ve seen, and since only a single combined audio stream is played in discord, I don’t expect any issues with my players’ computers either.

I just got through the moods for book 3, and I’m pleased to say that most are fine this time (I particularly liked the mood music for the Sodden Lands). As always it’s the busy combat moods that are challenging. I’ve listed the ones I had any difficulties with below, using the usual scoring system.

Kongamato Battle: 1
element=1704232&soundset=102155&mood=301260

Bharlen Sajor Battle: 1
element=1704232&soundset=102155&mood=301261

Boggard Mage Battle: 2
element=1704232&soundset=102155&mood=301265

Boggard Hunter Battle: 2
element=1704232&soundset=102155&mood=301266

Prison Shed Battle: 3
element=1704232&soundset=102155&mood=301267

Mobogo Battle: 3
element=1668717&soundset=102155&mood=301268

Hippo Battle: 1
element=1668717&soundset=102155&mood=301270

Abendego Brutes Battle: 1
element=1668717&soundset=102155&mood=301272

Cyclops Battle: 1
element=1704509&soundset=102156&mood=301294

Gogiteth Battle: 3
element=1704509&soundset=102156&mood=301295

Priest and Karumzek Battle: 1
element=1684042&soundset=102158&mood=301318

Abjal Kimon Battle: 2
element=1684042&soundset=102158&mood=301320

I’ll be away for a little bit myself soon, so we may have a bit of a delay before we get into book 4. As always, thanks for all your help with these!

[benjamin]

@leadmagnet

I just got through the moods for book 3

Yay! THANK YOU!

So my procedure with the ones you are rating 1 (which play FINE on MY benchmark machine) is to lighten the load just another chunk… so maybe check a couple of those to see if I have done enough for YOUR device.

And, oh boy, YUP, a couple of those 3’s were not playing on our device either, so THANKS for finding those! Keep the hunt going, it is REALLY appreciated… and MOST all = GET TO GAMING!

[leadmagnet]

For me, many of the moods I rated 1 would start fine, but a stutter would begin to appear after the mood had been playing for a little while. For example, Hippo Battle is fine for the first minute or so, and then begins to stutter for a bit. I’d be curious to know if you get the same effect on your benchmark machine or if that’s just me.

If I were to guess I’d say that the various sound effects on different timers get into sync once in a while and increase the workload temporarily.

Overall the effect on many of the 1s is pretty minor in general, so if they’re passing your benchmarks I think leaving them as-is would probably be fine. I’ll continue to include the ones I find going forward though, so that you can make your own judgements as to what’s needed.

[benjamin]

@leadmagnet

get into sync once in a while

Yeah, there were things like occasional distant animals, or occasional rain, or other occasional things… and that wouldn’t take much to suddenly be adding 3+ simultaneous samples to a mix that was already near the edge of coping (especially if they also started up a couple of different reverbs as well = i.e. had reverb settings different from those already running). Those are the sorts of things I have turned off = they were often almost complete inaudible anyway!

[leadmagnet]

Hi!

Apologies for the long delay there, I had to travel for work for a bit. I’ve looked into book 4, and it’s mostly fine. I’ve listed the moods that caused me issues, with the usual scoring system. As always, testing was done in the Vivaldi browser. This set had a few of the “fine at the start, but stutters later” pattern we’ve seen before, but the disruptions were more severe this time.

Welcome gift!: 1
soundset=103022&element=1761033&mood=300638

Grave dangers (Karina battle): 1.5
soundset=103023&element=1789568&mood=300649
I marked this one 1.5 because it starts fine (like some of the other 1s), but after a minute or so it stutters quite a lot

Sunburst corpse battle: 1.5
soundset=103023&element=1835264&mood=300657
This one also introduces some more significant stuttering after playing for a while

Drenchdead battle: 1
soundset=103024&mood=300666&element=1776707

Azure worm battle: 1
soundset=103024&mood=300668&element=1776707

Garrison battle: 1
soundset=103025&mood=300675&element=1791219

Sun-spires battle: 3
soundset=103025&mood=300682&element=1791219
N.B. There is already a lite variant of this one, which seems to perform fine

Worknesh and guards battle: 3
soundset=103025&mood=300683&element=1791219

Walkena’s fury: 2
soundset=103025&mood=300684&element=1791219

Thanks as always for your help/feedback!